Adjourned at 11:30 PM until I:00 PM Friday, Mar. 6, 1987


Edie Booth -- opening statement: Reviewed past relationship between Pat and herself. Stated reasons for making charges, that Pat allegedly used his office to effect or condone cheating to help his wife win AERC awards. Reviewed her charges, made additional comments, and showed documents. Gave oral statements regarding The Big D Best Condition, to the effect that Holly was pressured to provide a written Best Condition sheet due to the Heart Monitor award at the Great Texas Horse Race. An attempt to enter evidence on other matters not in the charges stated was not allowed.


Pat French -- opening statement. Reviewed written response.


Questions --


Heidi Flint -- "Why no recall." Peter Ansorge replied, #1, recall election gave no opportunity for parties to air their case, #2, Bylaws allow hearing before Board. Peter worked behind scenes to try to resolve situation.


Peter Ansorge -- stressed seriousness of matter: Highly respected people involved, need for full airing.


Heidi Flint -- regarding Big D BC, noted that Matthew Mackay-Smith arrived that afternoon. Statement by Matthew: Contracted to work 1st & part of 2nd day; arrived late due to poor directions. Examined horses about 1 hour after they finished. No recollection of being told or asked anything about BC judging. Not asked to sign papers, but asked to assist for safety of remaining competing horses. Recollection that the horse that won BC was in superior shape to the other horse present.


Heidi Flint -- expressed concern over planning for vets for the multi-day ride, and lack of adequate vet control.


Lindsay Taliaferro -- asked, is it a Director's responsible for getting vets for rides in his region?


Heidi Flint -- Director's wife responsible for this ride, and Director did not exercise oversight. Why did not the Director follow up on the lack of vet control?


Pat French -- questioned whether Heidi Flint has taken action on rides with control problems in her Region.


Tom Goton -- noted that Ride Manger is responsible, not Director. Pat had no obligation. Texas Endurance Riders Association paid Manager.


Crockett Dumas -- questioned Pat as to discrepancy between highest weight on BC form and the Heavyweight riders finishing the ride. Pat: other horses were lame or left before judging.


Jackie Mitchell -- What day was Pat not at ride? Pat -- 3rd and 4th. Jackie -- what day did Dr. Frazier cancel? Darolyn -- a day or two before the 1st day of ride. Pat & Darolyn deferred to Holly's advice that a vet need not be present during ride.


Heidi -- Who hired Matthew Mackay-Smith? Matthew -- Darolyn



Heidi    -- Dr. Frazier was hired by Pat & Darolyn. Darolyn:

stated   she co-ordinated vet hiring and ride managers.


Joe Long -- noted that although a Director is not responsible for a ride management error, if a Director knows of an illegal action that benefits a member of his family, and takes no action, he is responsible for that.


Pat -- stated he was not present during the BC judging, that

the first he knew of the BC problem was a year later.


Edie Booth -- states that Pat was present at the ride.


Barbara McCrary -- asked Pat why he didn't stay for BC? Pat:

my horse was off.


Peter Ansorge -- stated that he rode day 4; Pat & Darolyn set up GTHR; his perception is that in the heat of battle, they did not look as carefully at some things as they should have.


Edie -- stated that she signed for her day as Ride Manager.


Jim Bumgardner -- Edie, did you now Matthew was coming?

Edie: No.


Robert Puhl -- you must prove intent, that Pat influenced Holly to falsify form. Can you prove this? Edie: I tried to contact Holly.


Cindy Collins -- why did Holly not provide statement? Edie:

I tried to get one.


Cindy -- protest procedure. Was one made? Answer: No. Stated that if Pat had been given a protest and failed to act then he would be guilty.


Joe Long -- if Pat knew about the invalidity of the Best Condition, then he is guilty, but if he did not know about it, then he is not guilty.


Robbi Pruitt -- asked Darolyn who she showed her horse to for BC. Darolyn: Holly; I was uncomfortable with situation, but was reassured by arrival of Matthew Mackay-Smith, and believed he helped with this scoring.


Carolyn Roberts -- on the Houston Hustle, why did only 4 of 10 riders finish? Pat -- bad trail conditions. Edie -- Anne Pfieffer was a ghost rider on that ride.


 Pat: Anne's letter says otherwise. NOTE: There was confusion over which of Anne's letters was written and/or signed by Anne.


Heidi -- there was shoddy management, but malicious intent is not proven.


Jackie -- why was protest not filed. Edie: didn't know about it at time.


Peter -- case not proven. Statement by Peter to Edie: let's keep these problems in the region.


Final Statements:


Edie: Recap of need for action.


Pat: Recapped his previous response.


Vote: secret ballot, 2 yes, 15 no, 2 abstain.




R. Eiland & C. Lingar Hearing


Opening statement -- by Frank Bennet. Many questions raised over the Eiland & Lingar 1986 rides. Brought to the Board, as the Ethics Committee, to investigate whether unethical activity took place. Question as to 15 of C. Lingar's 19 BC's coming under vets hired by R. Eiland or C. Lingar.


Jim Bumgardner -- With only 4 or 5 riders, how can you afford a vet? Dr. Jack Daniels reputed to be an excellent vet. Can they justify 14-hour 100 mile time limit? Why Friday date? Randy agreed to change to Saturday. There is a quality problem with Eiland rides taking all available dates; Randy has agreed to give up a ride date to another ride.


Joe Long -- why are some members unable to get directions to C

Lingar ride?


Robbi Pruitt -- why does the ride have its own protest procedure

with a $50.00 fee?


The two cases were separated, with the items involving Chris Lingar addressed first:


I.          C. Lingar, Vet Conflict of interest. Defense: lack of local rides, need to put on rides to be able to enjoy riding, believes Dr. Dralle to be an excellent vet.


2.         C. Lingar, members unable to get info on rides: He does not

always know the start location in advance.




Lindsay Taliaferro -- are rides growing? Yes.


Louise Reidel -- questions effect on AERC credibility.


Everybody -- why doesn't he know where the rides will start? Waits to see weather conditions and impact of construction, etc. Much discussion over this question.


The Items involving Randy Eiland addressed next:


3.         R. Eiland -- large number of rides. Reason: lack of nearby rides, attempting to build the sport in local area. Has excellent site with good trail, with five different courses. Out of area riders come to ride.




Robbi Pruitt -- questions short riding time limits. Protest procedure out of line.


Heidi Flint -- time limits not appropriate. So many rides by

one manager keeps new managers out.


Jeri Scott -- time limits not appropriate.


Barbara McCrary -- when called about rides, was skeptical but found no rule against them. Time limits not appropriate. Protest procedure not appropriate. Can quality be maintained with such a schedule? Ride manager shouldn't ride their own rides.


Louise Reidel -- we don't have to sanction all rides that request it. Sanctioning Director should assure quality.


Jackie Mitchell -- Beaverdam ride asked for nine rides, they were only allowed eight, and some of those may be pulled if another manager wants the date.


Earl Baxter -- What is entry fee for100 mile ride? Eiland: $35 to $100. Vet charges ride $15.00 to $25.00 per horse in small rides. All are courses marked? Yes; Spotters on trail.


Peter Ansorge -- the problem is with the system. Fix the system, the problem of these kinds of rides will be solved.


Robert Pruitt -- Why the time limits and protest procedure? Eiland: Felt they were sufficient for that trail. Allowed for extension if 50% of riders needed it. Followed example of other rides in protest procedures, and had to deal with "prima donnas" who were prone to protest.


Jim B -- the "Duck" has been requiring protest fees for years. Not sure these rides (by Eiland) sacrificed quality.


Cindy Collins -- did a third party help pay expenses for these ride? Eiland: No.


Joe Long -- how can we be assured the rides were conducted properly with so few people present?


Les Cart -- address the whole issue of one or two person rides all over country.


Courtney Hart -- contrary to his letter: a protest was filed against Trilby Pederson on a R. Eiland ride; a horse was treated on a R. Eiland ride. Asked C. Lingar what he objected to on R. Eiland rides. C. Lingar: expected criticism of rides. Courtney: on Arabian Championship ride, a junior rode unsponsored. Eyewitness D. Butler stated that the junior rode unsponsored. Courtney asked if his rides did not make a mockery of AERC Championships. Eiland denied this.


            Lindsay Taliaferro -- summary -- sense of the Board is that no rules per se have been broken, although the Protest Procedure and time limits are not in accordance with AERC procedure. Rides may have actually performed a service by pointing up the problem. No further action taken against C. Lingar and R. Eiland by consensus